Inside the Trump transition team with James Carafano

James Jay Carafano is not the most likely subject of a St. Louis American Q&A. The vice president of Foreign and Defense Policy Studies at the conservative Heritage Foundation in Washington, D.C. is not an obvious match with a black weekly in St. Louis with a hyper-local focus and progressive Democratic politics.

But Carafano met the managing editor of The American while in St. Louis to promote a book during the Ferguson unrest. Whatever their differences in political orientation (conservative vs. progressive) and perspective (global vs. hyperlocal), they had a lively, enjoyable exchange and stayed in touch.

When Carafano returned to St. Louis on Thursday, May 4 for a panel discussion on homeland security that also included former U.S. Senator Jim Talent, he met with The American for an off-the-record catch-up conversation. In that private conversation, he shared that he had served on President-elect Trump’s transition team and given Trump direct, personal advice about foreign policy in small meetings.

At that point, it became irresistible to ask Carafano for an on-the-record exchange about that experience, which was conducted on May 10 via email.

St. Louis American: I was surprised to learn when we talked off-the-record that you served on President-elect Trump’s transition team, advising on foreign policy. I would love to have a version of that conversation on the record. What surprised you, working with the president-elect so closely?

James Carafano: The transition team is different from the campaign. It is non-partisan activity, so it is non-political, firewalled from campaign, activity. The mission of the transition team is to help the president-elect prepare to govern. This includes drafting initial guidance to federal agencies, including executive orders; assessing the state of the agencies, including their policies, programs and budgets; and what an incoming president would have to do align the government with the new administration’s priorities.

That activity started after the party formally nominates the candidate at their respective convention. The federal government, through the GSA, provides office space and administrative support (like phones and computers). Both the Clinton and Trump transition teams were in the same building, albeit on different floors, at 1717 Pennsylvania Ave. 

After the election the Trump transition team was moved to GSA building on F Street. The first task was to merge the folks working on the transition with those who worked on the campaign.  Then prepare the president and the incoming cabinet for running the government – so it’s a bit like organizing merger and acquisition.

I led the State Department transition team from the Convention to the election and the Homeland Security Department transition team from the Election to the Inauguration. We helped prepare the cabinet nominees for their confirmation hearings and the initial set of priorities for the incoming administration. We would also visit and meet with folks from the agencies, in my case the Homeland Security headquarters on Nebraska Avenue, to coordinate transition matters. Much of the initial efforts of the administration after the Inauguration reflected the work of the transition teams.  

I must say from my perspective I thought the transition team and the Obama administration worked very well together. We got nothing but exceptional support and cooperation from the Homeland Security folks.

In recent years, Congress has amended the law governing transitions. In the wake of 9/11, there was a concern that the new president ought to be up and running on day one and have at least part of the cabinet on board in case something happened. From that perspective, I think the transition team worked well. Secretary Kelly [John F. Kelly, Homeland Security secretary], for example, was confirmed by the Senate on Inauguration Day and was running the department when Trump walked into the White House.

Heritage was uniquely suited to help out on the transition team. First, we are an idea factory so when folks were looking for ideas on what to we had plenty of those. Second, we pay as much attention to governance as policy. If you want to understand how Washington works and how to manage it, you have to know the government – the structure, people, programs and budgets of the department and how they function. We track that. The governance expertise was important to presidential transition.

In a parliamentary system you have “Shadow Ministers” who track agencies day to day and are prepared to move in and take over if their party is elected to power. The U.S. system is completely different. Many of the cabinet officials didn’t even know they were going to be cabinet officials until weeks before the Inauguration. In addition, many cabinet officials were not all Washington hands and didn’t have “tribes” of people around them who they had worked with before to follow them into government. So having folks, like the Heritage folks around with great knowledge expertise was a big help.

Many of the folks on the transition were like me – we weren’t looking and didn’t even want a job in government. That was helpful because we were just focused on getting the team up and running, not what office we wanted. 

St. Louis American: Progressives like me, as you must know, fear Steve Bannon as someone who has said things that suggest he would welcome cataclysmic change in government and the world order, and would for that reason welcome cataclysm. Without endorsing this view of Bannon, what did you see working close to Trump and Bannon that might encourage us in the bleacher seats that Bannon is not empowered to lead us into World War III?

James Carafano: I can only speak from my perspective of working with the national security team during the transition and now being back at Heritage observing and talking to the folks in government. My observation is that when it comes to national security and foreign policy matters, the people the president consults with and relies on are his national security team including the cabinet officials and the NSC (National Security Council) staff.

St. Louis American: You told me the president hired some top-notch foreign policy guys out from under you at Heritage. Who did you lose? What are they doing now? Why will you miss them? What do you expect they are telling the president and his leadership team that we should be doing?

James Carafano: One of my staff was selected to be the chief of staff for the UN ambassador. Another is working at the Pentagon. Another is serving on the NSC staff. There are other folks in Heritage that have gone to work in the administration as well. That said, Heritage is not a revolving door where people go to wait until they can go back into government. The folks that left me all had very particular skills and knowledge that would be valuable to an administration putting together foreign and defense, so I really can’t complain that they were recruited away.  But we always saw ourselves as an independent think tank providing ideas as our main contribution – not a staffing agency.  That said, Heritage did help compile lists of qualified people to work in the new administration.

St. Louis American:  Hypothetical. Phone rings and the president wants to talk to you. You meet, and he says he remembers you had bright things to say about foreign policy during the transition, and he wanted to have you back in to hear your thoughts on foreign policy now that he is more settled. You’ve got one pitch to the president of the United States regarding your sphere of expertise. What do you tell him we should do, and why?

James Carafano: My advice hasn’t changed since I worked on the transition. There are three key parts of the world where U.S. vital interests are at stake – Europe, the Middle East and Asia. Any significant regional conflict in any of them would be damaging to the U.S., so the U.S. ought to be work to promote peace and stability in all three. The U.S. does that by being present and safeguarding its interests.

I think that is an approach the Trump administration will likely adopt. He is not an isolationist. Also, I don’t think he agreed with the Obama strategy of disengagement and withdrawal. Nor is he inclined to the more muscular policy that Bush followed. He seems to be inclined to a middle ground.

As to the threats to regional stability, I think there is real bipartisan consensus on what the concerns are – Russia, China, North Korea, Iran and ISIS/al Qaeda. In addition, the administration has many concerns about the transnational criminal cartels that impact not just Latin America but also Europe, Asia and Africa. 

St. Louis American: I first met you when you were in St. Louis talking about a new book and I was mired in Ferguson. What is your latest book or the next book project?

James Carafano: I am writing a history of the Allied campaign in Papua/New Guinea during World War II. I am a historian by training, and while I love working on contemporary issues, I think it is important to be grounded in history and real-life experience.